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Patrick4
@patrick4
3 years ago
6 posts

What about fish? I've heard that this systemic issue is an exception in the area of fish meat. Even if technically, though our very being depends on and has depended on our nature as adaptable creatures, utilizing whatever we have, our systems are not optimally designed to process red meats, Such matters as fish and eggs remain. Put into the proper context, the point of loving animals but still being a part of nature by pursuing your own nature seems to stand. Fish are just as alive as anything else, but how come people leave them as an exception?

Really I don't think our body was 'designed' for anything in particular. Whether you believe in evolution or not or whatever the stance of humanity within nature is in your worldview, humans are adaptable creatures. From the very beginning there have been different tribes which consumed different things: some relied only on wheat or corn, some o fruits or berries, some on streams and fishing, and others on following the herds. And all that perhaps before agriculture?
soaring eagle said:

it is not our natural diet and ofcourse u stop anything for 2 days you go throufgh withdrawl u need a year to detox..it is a toxic sun=bstance that u need to clean out of your system in order to regain health


updated by @patrick4: 07/22/15 11:30:14AM
Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

I have read Rudolf Steiners original lectures called Agriculture which describes the process of bio-dynamics. Bio-dynamics does require the use of animal parts to create the compost additives, it is far to involved for me to go into here. But for instance, the main compost additive call preparation 500, requires a cow horn, generally sourced from a slaughter house, not a sacrifice, to be filled with cow manure and buried until fully composted, and then a small amount is added to a compost heap to help create a very high grade compost. Another preparation involves the use of a deer bladder filled with chamomile flowers and buried until composted, and added in a similar way. I have never read anything in Rudolf Steiners lectures regarding sacrifice, but that is of little concern anyway( not the sacrifice, but to the meaning of your post) but I agree we should all be educated regarding bio-dynamics to be able to make a decision on whether this food is for the individual. I eat it.

A Heart On Fire said:

I'd like to put forward the notion that if you're a vegetarian/vegan, and you like biodynamic foods, that's a massive contradiction. the 'preparations' involved in biodynamics requires a sacrificial cow, where some of its body parts such as horns, skull, and certain organs are used, some of which need to be taken from a lactating cow! and its very, very involved with holistic food production. biodynamics incorporates so many subtle influences of the cosmos. its an incredibly spiritual practice.

maybe some of the vegetarians would benefit from learning about biodynamics, after all, I bet you like to eat biodynamic products....
☮ soaring eagle ॐ
@soaring-eagle
3 years ago
27,404 posts

actualy what doesnt make sense is how humans take ourselves out of the composting equation (for the most part:) animals eat poop and die what they intake returns to the soil the cycle is plants use the minerals in the soil (returning much of it after losing leaves or dting) vegatarians digest plant matter returning much in poop or death carnivores devour veh=gatarians again returning much to the soil in poop or death

but humans consume consume consume removing our waste from the cycle treating it chemically etc and when we die we do all we can to prevent decomposition

it makes perfect sence to alow animals to compost and return to the soil after all the soil is decomposed organic matter..wether vegatable or animal..we are meant to return to the soil to feed a new generation of plants that feed the rest of life on earth

since humans stopped shitting in the woodsa and rotting where they die the topsoil depletion become serious an issue




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Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

yes that is right
A Heart On Fire said:

also from my understanding prep500 is generally an all rounder, primarily used in the fields, whereas the other, more specific preparations are used in compost
Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

Biodynamics originated in Europe, it is ancient apparently and Rudolf Steiner re-discovered it through spiritual investigation. I understand it could be seen as a contradiction, and vegetarians are sometimes attacked over these apparent contradictions, kind of like some folks like to catch us out. I am vegetarian, I don't eat animals, I do have dairy.

I don't eat deer bladders, but I will eat the vegetables that are grown from the compost made within the bladder. :)

I do what I can, I have leather work boots. I think perhaps a vegan may have an issue with bio-dynamics. It's a fine line with bio-dynamics, but because I deeply respect Rudolf Steiner, who was also vegetarian, I accept this method.

I do not have a problem with your questioning by the way Heart on Fire, I am 100% happy with what I am doing with my diet. I am always interested in learning.

peace

Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

Yeah, ok, that maybe true. But I did say, "it is ancient apparently and Rudolf Steiner re-discovered it through spiritual investigation". Steiner was greatly clairvoyant and received information, that is what I meant by spiritual investigation.
A Heart On Fire said:

that may be true however I think you'd discover that, before the term 'biodynamics' was even coined, many of the ideas and techniques employed therein were already being practised by cultures throughout the world. Steiner did not invent them. he took pieces from here there and everywhere and brought them together to become part of a system that was easier for western culture to integrate

for example, goats blood has been used as a symbol of fertility by many different people's. they would spear the goat in the neck and allow it to wander the fields until death. everywhere its blood was spilled was considered to be significantly improved with good juju. its the same ideas behind biodynamics. they weren't invented by Steiner. he just saw, and liked what he saw, and said yeah I can work with this.
Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

According to the book of the original lectures I have, Steiner was giving the lectures to local farmers, and he was saying the whole way through the lectures that it must all be tested and experiments would have to be done. And that the preparations should be spread on as much of the earth as possible, so in that sense it was for the west, but really for the whole world, but firstly it was for farmers in, I think, Switzerland
A Heart On Fire said:

that may be true however I think you'd discover that, before the term 'biodynamics' was even coined, many of the ideas and techniques employed therein were already being practised by cultures throughout the world. Steiner did not invent them. he took pieces from here there and everywhere and brought them together to become part of a system that was easier for western culture to integrate

for example, goats blood has been used as a symbol of fertility by many different people's. they would spear the goat in the neck and allow it to wander the fields until death. everywhere its blood was spilled was considered to be significantly improved with good juju. its the same ideas behind biodynamics. they weren't invented by Steiner. he just saw, and liked what he saw, and said yeah I can work with this.
Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

A vegetarian diet can become an individual and absolute necessity. In spite of the fears aroused by our industrialized agriculture, the individual who finds himself disgusted enough with meat will surely survive as a vegetarian along with the herbivores. For in the last analysis, as Steiner shows, the problem of nutrition is not simply one involving the nutritional shortcomings of plants important as that problem may be. It is rather one in which an individual's own inner spiritual activity takes part in directing the satisfaction of his nutritional needs.

Gilbert Church, Ph.D.
New York City
June 2, 1968

Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

Thats cool, it doesn't feel hijacked to me. Bio-dynamics is a subject I love, its been a few years since I thought much about it. Steiner is one of the Spiritual Teachers I first read, he's really an amazing guy. Everyone should read some of his work.

peace

A Heart On Fire said:

yeah. sorry for hijacking your thread man
Tim5
@tim5
3 years ago
359 posts

the 'nutritional shortcomings of plants' is referring to the way plants are grown with artificial fertiliser etc, not the natural nutritional value of plants.

Tim said:

A vegetarian diet can become an individual and absolute necessity. In spite of the fears aroused by our industrialized agriculture, the individual who finds himself disgusted enough with meat will surely survive as a vegetarian along with the herbivores. For in the last analysis, as Steiner shows, the problem of nutrition is not simply one involving the nutritional shortcomings of plants important as that problem may be. It is rather one in which an individual's own inner spiritual activity takes part in directing the satisfaction of his nutritional needs.

Gilbert Church, Ph.D.
New York City
June 2, 1968

 
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